Tag Archives: jesus

Je·sus (jē′zəs)

Jesus was a good 1st century rabbi , a prophet, who after his death got enveloped into some of the then current speculative theological ideas and concepts present him as he God. 

The central problem is that the person Jesus became far more important to christians than did his message of repentance. His supposed role as  a warrior messiah or prophet who miraculously  at the hands of Israel’s enemies overshadowed by trinitarian idea about a dying and resurrected redeemer.

Even all of the scriptures (the Torah and the Gospel) show that the commandments taught by Moses are more important for people to follow (for Jews) than theology or miracles when it comes to knowing the biblical “truth.”

Even Gentiles are taught to observe the basics (Acts 15)

Jesus cried out to God on the cross and God heard him

A Christian argue that Quranic narrative on the crucifixion of Jesus s either completely irrational or unjust or both. According to him :

 If it was a real person that was crucified in the place of Jesus then we have a pagan sacrifice of an innocent person in place of the “guilty” person which is what Islamic apologists are always telling us is unjust and pagan. On top of that he must have been a madman who enjoyed being crucified to serve Allah and save the prophet. An alien or a ghost perhaps? Whatever “solution” Islam comes up with it is either completely irrational or unjust or both.

It is a silly argument.

For a believer It is much more common sense to agree with the Quranic narrative .

For a prophet of God to die by crucifixion would have meant God is defeated by falsehood.
The Quran assure that God will defend those who believe (Q22:49) and confound the plots of the enemies of Christ (Q3:54).

If he is indeed  a believer in God, dismissing how God saved one of his prophet (Matthew 14:5, Matthew 21:11, Matthew 21:46, Luke 24:19, John 4:19, John 6:14, John 7:40 , Luke 13:33, Matthew 13:57) as irrational is laughable.

But if he is an atheist then I will accept his anti-supernatural presuppositions.

Anything but irrational nor unjust the Quran solves one problem in alleged crucifixtion of Jesus when he cried for Gods help on the cross “My God, my God, why have You forsaken me?”

Why should Jesus have thought himself as being abandoned from God at the very moment when, according to innovated pauline theology, he was fulfilling God’s plan??

Is he  seriously to believe that Jesus, who is supposed to be God’s equal according to his logic and a great respected prophet according to Islam fell into deep depression and anguish and God did not help him??

No!!

God hears Jesus cry for help and has helped him.

Jesus did not die on a cross but God miraculously took Jesus body and soul into the heavens and God made it appear to his enemies eyes that Jesus was crucified. (Q 4:157-158)

How did God do that?  the Quran do not go into detail how but it is easy for the creator of this Universe to save his messenger and make it to appear not so to his enemies.

This Christian has a gross misunderstanding on what the Quran says. Nowhere in the Quran which says about a man being enjoyed as a replacement for Jesus in the cross.

The Quran is very accurate when it says that those who believe that Jesus *died* on the cross therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow. (Q4:158).

Even the biblical narratives of the crucifixion contradict each other and are therefore untrustworthy. The bible report that a chaos and a great confusion emerged because of the darkness and the earthquake, so that nobody knew, what happened to Jesus.

He and his apologist master J. White deal with strawman here.  Yes Cruficixion event happened as the Quran also tells us (4:157). However it does not necessarily mean Jesus was crucified to death.

Quran categorically did not denies not the crucifixion event/ historicity but the Christian idea of Jesus DIED by crucifixion and ressurected for salvation in the cross.

Jesus did not go around preaching that forgiveness of sins was through his death but instead through simple repentance to God – without a mediator – see Matthew 5-7 ‘The Sermon on the Mount’ for example.

Video

Jesus (pbuh) in the Scriptures by br. Alie Ataie

Ali Ataie is one of my favorite speaker, he is very eloquent and knowledgeable. I hope I can see him more in the da’wah debates in the future.

Public Debate: Was Jesus Crucified? James White vs Sami Zaatari – 19th September 2012

The crux of White argument is “..It is the majority opinion of all scholars, all historians, both believers and unbelievers – that Jesus of Nazareth was crucified and killed but the 40 words in the Quran denies this, thus the the Quran is wrong.

White seems confusing himself with the muslim view of Jesus “crucifixion” with the death of Jesus (p).

1. There is no historical evidence that Jesus of Nazareth was crucified *to death* by the instigation of the Jewish leadership under the Roman governor, Pontius Pilate, around 30 AD. What is our proof of an ‘historical’ event of Jesus died on the cross?
2. Sami made a good point when he says in the debate that the fact that the historical event that people believe Jesus was crucified confirms the Quran in 4:157 that people assume it was Jesus.
3. Yes, the majority opinion of all scholars, all historians, both believers and unbelievers thinks that Jesus of Nazareth lived and existed and that the crucifixion happened but they thinks that Jesus (p) was a real person: an itinerant apocalyptic preacher who wasn’t divine and the majority of them too question the Resurrection of Jesus.
The Quran addresses that Jesus will dies in some manner like everybody else but it does not say Jesus died by crucifixion ie he was crucified?
وَالسَّلَامُ عَلَيَّ يَوْمَ وُلِدتُّ وَيَوْمَ أَمُوتُ وَيَوْمَ أُبْعَثُ حَيًّا
wal-salāmu ʿalayya yawma wulidttu wayawma amūtu wayawma ub’ʿathu ḥayyan
“And peace is on me the day I was born and the day I will die and the day I am raised alive.”
(Q 19:33)
The verb “amūtu” 1st person singular imperfect present coninuous form fi’il madhi’ فعل مضارع
Similar Verse is 19:15 , mentioning about prophet John the Baptist.

Regarding Jesus (p) death, there are several opinion among muslims scholars based on highly ambiguous verse Q 4:157 :

1) That Jesus did not die on a cross but that God made someone else look like Jesus. Then God miracolously took Jesus body and soul into the heavens.

2) That Jesus actually survived the cross and lived like the other men (Gistas & Dismas) crucifed alongside with him (some historian record this man survived the cross)

3) a few even goes further thas Jesus (p) ‘died’ but as the Qur’an says do not think that those who are killed in the way of God they are dead, they are alive but they perceive it not like in 1 Corinthians 15:31. “I die every day”.

Whichever the opinions we Muslims does not think too much on the detail surrounding how Jesus died or will die but unanimous that he will just needs to die in some way but not that Jesus be crucified and ressurected and Jesus (p) will come back to earth again to fight the army of Satan and break the pagan symbol cross in the end of time.